What’s wrong with poetry?

[Leanne]

Everyone always seems to ignore my suggestions to get away from the intellectuals and those that have the 9 to 5, and give the poetry back to the bums that can't get a real job.

And maybe that's the difference between you and me. I'm an intellectual who isn't jealous of the bums or want them exterminated. I wish the bums could say the same.

[serge gurkski]

I know a lot of intellectual bums.
Some are arseholes (not excluding myself). But I know asses worse than me. And sexier asses anyway.
cheers

sg

[saeity]

Like I said earlier. You let the bums have enough time and energy to be poets, and they'll accidentally become intelligent craftsman.

Ha ha methinks you could be right rowens, interesting thread btw think you are all making valid points. Personally I think it's harder to critique and edit because your actually conscious of your thoughts if that makes sense actually does that mean tectac you truly are a bastard

[newsclippings]

I'd say Rowens is an intellectual who wants to be seen as a bum.

Oops.

[tectak]

Like I said earlier. You let the bums have enough time and energy to be poets, and they'll accidentally become intelligent craftsman.

Ha ha methinks you could be right rowens, interesting thread btw think you are all making valid points. Personally I think it's harder to critique and edit because your actually conscious of your thoughts if that makes sense actually does that mean tectac you truly are a bastard

I try not to mask my reek of sincerity....if that's what you mean by "really"
Best,
tectak

[rowens]

I need somebody like newsclippings with her qualifications and professional options to take me in, before I get kicked out of my sister's house.

I couldn't even get a job in this town teaching illiterate people to read, and that was volunteer work.

And I think Leanne, as always, misread my recommendations. I don't want to exterminate the intellectuals, I just want them to stop working so much, and stop thinking about commas so much.

There are lots of poems, and the poems I like the most are the ones that are trying to fill some sense of emptiness. Trying to deal with something that's gone, or something that was never here, or something that's not right, or doesn't allow you to live like you feel you could be or should be. I think there is something wrong with poetry, because if there wasn't, we'd all be able to be quiet, and not even feel any need to worry over it. I think there's something wrong with the world. And the biggest fault I see with the world is that I like it exactly as it is.

[escorial]

Poetry lacks the ability to stay fresh and move in and out of trends to put it on the radio,tv..ect..for public consumption..instead what you've got is a select few using it as a medium for expressing alot of structure and intelectual pandering.

[shemthepenman]

You know, I hear this fifty times a day, the notion that we are all homogenised: pseudo-intellectual nonsense…
‘judge Schreber has sunbeams in his ass. A solar anus. And rest assured that it works: judge Schreber feels something, produces something, and is capable of explaining the process theoretically: the effects of a machine, not mere metaphors.’
There is no conspiracy in poetry, only the effects. If you feel left out, then write something better, no matter how twisted… it will punch through all that, and connect to the reader directly onto the nervous system… a laugh, a tear, a thought, a sigh… not a ‘oh look, he’s said nothing, but wow! he’s omitted the gap between the comma, must be a genius…’ that is nothing but a Freudian nightmare.

[escorial]

poetry lacks poets who see outside the box

[shemthepenman]

oh my god, you even talk in cliche... there is no help for you.

---

[i was only joking]

[escorial]

beyond help omg

[shemthepenman]

ok, so here is a request, write something structured, well, and with punctuation perfect… post it in serious. I would ask Picasso the same. I suppose the problem is, you write such poor poetry (and all get drawn into the problem of poetry) that no one can comment on your style, technic, or anything… show me you can write poetry. then I’ll take your more experimental poetry more seriously.

[escorial]

omg cliche

[Leanne]

poetry lacks poets who see outside the box

Anyone who thinks they write "outside the box" is still thinking in terms of confinement. If you can't see how every well-written poem bleeds in a million different and unexpected directions without concession to the labels of the ignorant, then this is your lack. There is no box. There is only poetry.

[escorial]

confinement is not how i read..outside the box

[Leanne]

But thinking in terms of "the box" shows that you have an "us and them" mentality -- which pretty much indicates that you think everything that's already been done should be stored away and forgotten.

[Todd]

I remember reading how Ginsberg really pushed the conventions. In his day, but even his critics admitted his talent. I've read good experimental work. The question I would ask about any poem. Is what specifically places it outside the box? It can't be purely subjective.

[Leanne]

For anyone to innovate, there needs to be an innate understanding of the conventions which they are breaking. That really means that unless you can do what other poets do with equal facility, any "innovation" is going to lack credibility. Ginsberg could write in several different styles, understood meter and had a great ability with rhyme and other poetic devices.

[escorial]

you assume a lot from so little leanne

[Leanne]

Oh, so mysterious.