01.01.16

[Magpie]

Tough one.  From the US, I never would have caught that.  If I had, yes, it would have come across fairly callous if you had used retard or spaz.  I googled it and first thing that popped up was a restaurant in California.

So, you didn't mean that.   And to shift its meaning ... in few words....  I am not sure.  But maybe I could throw some tools you can try / alter as you see fit.

And I think the quotes don't help, it confused me more.


Joy --

crooked smile ---

In spite of spacca (awkward)


Spacca kids
Smile, joy. (Etc, you get the idea)

Not sure if  this helps, hopefully not an inappropriate response.

Hi aschueler, don't worry, there's no such thing as an inappropriate response, especially regarding this poem and I have learnt a great deal from all the responses I got. Firstly the culture thing will probably always be too hard to convey completely as it is bound to be different when growing up with certain words. A couple of years ago I would have just assumed, wrongly, that the word meant the same to everyone and that may have caused even more problems. The other thing that you mentioned which was very helpful was the use of quotation marks, which instead of being the device that I thought would clarify the situation did the exact opposite and brought more attention to the word. I guess there's a cliche about forest and trees that applies here.

I've made an edit with the help from everyone's comments, thanks for the input.

Mark

Mark,
This is my first time reading this, but being that it's not much to digest (five words) I'll try and have a go at what you're asking.

The first thing I'd change is the title; it feels kind of wasted (especially if this piece is meaningful to you) to entitle it simply with the date it was shared (kinda reminds me of a poem titled "poem one" or somethin like that). Perhaps you have your reasons but I'm not seeing any, personally.

And being an American thats spent three years in England, I'd imagine I possibly have a bit more to offer you in terms of this particular discussion, but to be honest I've never heard the term 'spacca.' That said, it seems the most offensive word I learned in my travels (and this goes for both countries) is 'cunt.' Something about calling someone a 'cunt' just makes me cringe if used improperly, and furious is used properly(toward me). Maybe your perception of 'spacca' being so offensive is more of a personal thing? I know this is also subcultural, but in the hip-hop community 'spaz' specifically is actually quite the compliment (i.e. "Did you hear that dude? He hella spazzed on that track"), but again to call someone with cerebral palsy a spaz(spacca) is just fucked up. Hmm, maybe make it more apparent that the children are mocking someone with a mental condition? If your friend understood right away though that may not be the issue.

Children are by far the cruelest in terms of verbal animosity-- that said I wouldn't be afraid to get even nastier, children have no filter, so why should you in this one? Hehe just my opinion though. And honestly, I think the British (not sure bout Scots) have far more nicer children than the States. So if you were worried about international appeal, well to me thats all the more reason to get even nastier.

Also, Americans tend to be a bit uh, how do I put this lightly... Stupider? Especially at the age of a young child. I believe our educational system is to blame, America seems set on a curriculum that focuses on glorifying the country and seems more of a brainwashing system than an educational system (ope, here comes my conspiracy theories...). England (again not sure bout Scotland but I'd imagine theyre pretty similar) is all about cramming as much knowledge into a childs brain and making them realize they're not children at an early age, I mean you got 16 year olds learning what 18-21 year olds over here are learning. That said, in a poem of five words, where the main focus/meaning/power is dependent on the word 'spacca' might be where the effect becomes lost.

What makes a word offensive/empowering? In reflection of what I just wrote, I'd have to go with context. I had no idea someone with a mental condition was being described in this one, yet I also had no idea what spacca meant either. But even in this context, 'laughing' sounds a bit playful (as children are, which helps to the innocence you're going for). You also have 'children laughing at the "spacca"' which kinda reads like the speaker him/herself is calling the person a 'spacca.' The quotes kinda leave me a bit more confused too, personally. 

A "fun" game the children used to play when I lived in Louisiana was to pick on one child to the point he/she literally breaks down to tears or goes crazy and starts fighting. This sometimes would take up the whole recess, sometimes it would take days, so not one insult, but many were thrown at the victim (children with mental conditions were not excluded). Maybe 'spacca' isnt enough?

Anyway, I hope this helps, and I hope you're not offended with my comparing England to Scotland. They seemed culturally pretty similar but I've only been to Edinburgh so I wouldn't truly know. Thanks for bumping this was cool to run into,
mike

Hi Mike, thanks for your comments and input on this. First of all you're right, the title does seem odd and I never thought about it at the time. It's a hangover habit from when I used to write haiku here and instead of having 30 odd poems with the title haiku I started just putting the date instead, so in theory untitled, but yeah I see how it's confusing.
You are totally spot on with the use of the word 'cunt' and how offensive it is when you say, 'if used improperly'. Where I'm from your best mate can call you 'a daft cunt' and it's fine but if a stranger did the same it would be a different matter regardless of whether it was in an aggressive way or not. It's about context, although saying that there are some places you just wouldn't say it at all. But with 'spacca' it's not the same it's taboo and always inappropriate and for that reason it can be used by people who are disabled and then it's empowering much in the same way that the n word is for black people. Although for me that seems to have lost its power by being overused and also now I see it used by white people calling other people it, regardless of race either as an insult or as an expression of friendship. Whether this just happens on the net I'm not sure. This is one of the definitions from urban dictionary - "1.describes an ignorant, uneducated, foolish individual regardless of race, color, religion, sexual orientation, etc. 2. endearing term between two or more individual to describe a friendship or bond." If that is true it has lost its power, which is a shame because it is such a powerful tool to reclaim or claim the word that was used to insult you with and then use the word yourself. In this country 'spacca' still has that huge power, I've seen it on talk show where a female comedian with cerebral palsy used it in an empowering way and it scares the crap out of the people who are there. I seemed to have got somewhat sidetracked, but the word 'cunt' no matter how it was used could never have the same empowering effect that the other two words do. In fact now I realise that's how I should have described 'spacca', as a comparison with the n word, (I still can't type it out as a word, I cringe too much) it would be the same as a white person calling a black person that word.
I better move on to the next comment or I'll be here all night. Much appreciate all of your thoughts on this, all has helped a great deal. Oh by the way I don't mind at all that you compare England with Scotland, I'm actually English but living in Scotland, well sort of English, I'm a Geordie, but there's another cultural thing that could take a while to explain. Another time perhaps.

Thanks again,

Mark

Hey Mark. I managed to get this far.   I think if there is a cultural difference in connotation or gravity, it should be considered when writing, but also when reading. Cultural centricity is not a poem breaker. Personally, I "got" the poem as is. You could address some of your concerns by modifying "children" for clarity, but I don't think you need to. I do wonder if the quotes on "spacca" empower the word more than you intend.
I'm not sure if any of that helps, but I'm following. 
Paul

Hi Paul, thanks for your thoughts on this and to answer your question, yes it certainly does help. Clear and precise as always especially what you said about empowering the word. I've just mentioned in my last comment about how the word can now be used as an empowering word but as you noted the use of quotes help to empower it in the opposite direction, like a more effective insult. Which is totally not what I wanted. I've made an edit taking into consideration everyones comments, thanks for your input.

Mark

Hi Mark,
Think this is a worthy subject to pursue further 9esp after reading your notes) and good that you have given it a bump and set up a discussion starter.

I am wondering if perhaps it could be set out as a paired poem with a flip side stanza to read the other way.
(the perspective of the tormentors and the protectors)
we had a couple of kids in our school and it was about 50 /50 over the side who looked out for them and included them and those who were mean.

Hi AJ, thanks for reading and your comments also. You're right about it being a worthy subject to pursue, at first I felt awkward about bumping this but I have learnt so much from the comments and even as I am writing replies I have noticed things that I wouldn't have done otherwise.
I like your suggestion of a 'flip side stanza' giving a different perspective, it is definitely a way of covering all angles and covering myself at the same time. I will definitely consider it and give it more thought. For the moment I have made an edit that I think is a slight improvement.
Thanks for the suggestion and your input,

Mark

a suggestion would be

children
laughing -
a "spacca"

missed this and many more poems. i read it as a derogatory word for spastic or other special needs person. i think it actually captures an all too common scene.

Hi Billy, thanks for the comments, I have made an edit based on all comments with the main alteration being the removal of the quotation marks that seemed to highlight the word too much. Your suggestion has really got me thinking also because it does seem to solve a few issues and I like the way that it is simpler yet clearer. I'm thinking that if I removed the quotation marks from your suggestion it would still work because it doesn't give the impression that the author is using the word 'spacca' to describe the person. I will think on it and probably wait for a couple of days first before I look at it again and hopefully it will be immediately clear.
Thanks for the input and making me think in a different direction,

Mark