11-18-2013, 05:05 AM
This point is going to be largely off-topic
Well, the original question is 'what role does poetry take in discourse'. If we use this discussion as our example, the better question would be, 'what role does discourse take on poetry'--not a very pleasant one it seems.
Pretense, for me, is of course of a fully forgivable and even sometimes attractive sin. If I wasn't trying to be impressive when I was fourteen (not to imply I don't suffer from pretense now), I never would have read Marx and learned my love for political science and social imagination; I never would have read Tolkien and discovered my love for fantasy; and I never would have read Wilde and discovered my love for writing. Pretense is the idea that we are more than we currently are, and that can have some very healthy consequences if we're willing to explore that pretense.
Now you, jdeirmend, made a self deprecating nod to inherent pretense of the discussion which ameliorates any of that particular sin present. What really bothers me though is the seeing the precise sort of anti-intellectualism that cripples us today.
Billy, you should have gathered from my reference to six brothers that I derive from an Irish-immigrant family (an entire people allergic to rubbers). All of my life I've been called a nancy-boy in one form or another, which is fitting since my mum's name is Nancy. But it certainly didn't stop me from ranting about whatever intellectual quest I found myself on in pubs. Stating that we share a space with bullyin' buttfucks doesn't validate them or invalidate us. Every single one of my friends called me a faggot when I told them about this very forum and how I was trying to get better at poetry. BUT they also, after mocking me for about an hour and telling me to fuck off, listened to my poems and told me what they liked or disliked, or just gave an honest confession that they never really 'liked' poetry.
Point being, a discussion might feel like nothing but warm air to you, but it doesn't change the fact that it can be lovely and even rarely enlightening to shoot the shit on whatever interests.
But can we leave the mean shit at the pubs, where it belongs? Jdeirmend, you're not a nobody-- you're clearly an intelligent person engaged on a given topic of interest. I'm just sorry that I've not studied poetical theory and so can't give anything back but my own understanding.
To the rest: you don't need to clarify 'this discussion is nothing and I can gain nothing'. Just don't join conversation then. Going out of your way to say you're disinterested is about the single most pretentious thing anyone can do but with the extra touch of being both ignorant and cruel.
Well, the original question is 'what role does poetry take in discourse'. If we use this discussion as our example, the better question would be, 'what role does discourse take on poetry'--not a very pleasant one it seems.
Pretense, for me, is of course of a fully forgivable and even sometimes attractive sin. If I wasn't trying to be impressive when I was fourteen (not to imply I don't suffer from pretense now), I never would have read Marx and learned my love for political science and social imagination; I never would have read Tolkien and discovered my love for fantasy; and I never would have read Wilde and discovered my love for writing. Pretense is the idea that we are more than we currently are, and that can have some very healthy consequences if we're willing to explore that pretense.
Now you, jdeirmend, made a self deprecating nod to inherent pretense of the discussion which ameliorates any of that particular sin present. What really bothers me though is the seeing the precise sort of anti-intellectualism that cripples us today.
Billy, you should have gathered from my reference to six brothers that I derive from an Irish-immigrant family (an entire people allergic to rubbers). All of my life I've been called a nancy-boy in one form or another, which is fitting since my mum's name is Nancy. But it certainly didn't stop me from ranting about whatever intellectual quest I found myself on in pubs. Stating that we share a space with bullyin' buttfucks doesn't validate them or invalidate us. Every single one of my friends called me a faggot when I told them about this very forum and how I was trying to get better at poetry. BUT they also, after mocking me for about an hour and telling me to fuck off, listened to my poems and told me what they liked or disliked, or just gave an honest confession that they never really 'liked' poetry.
Point being, a discussion might feel like nothing but warm air to you, but it doesn't change the fact that it can be lovely and even rarely enlightening to shoot the shit on whatever interests.
But can we leave the mean shit at the pubs, where it belongs? Jdeirmend, you're not a nobody-- you're clearly an intelligent person engaged on a given topic of interest. I'm just sorry that I've not studied poetical theory and so can't give anything back but my own understanding.
To the rest: you don't need to clarify 'this discussion is nothing and I can gain nothing'. Just don't join conversation then. Going out of your way to say you're disinterested is about the single most pretentious thing anyone can do but with the extra touch of being both ignorant and cruel.
If I could say only one thing before I die, it'd probably be,
"Please don't kill me"
"Please don't kill me"