02-15-2012, 11:06 AM
"Can you give me an example of how you would reword that part? "
Here are the best I can think of but it won't work.
She crazed into the room" "she demented into the room"
The problem is that when you say someone is insane you are using an adjective because you are describing a state of being. Such words cannot be used as verbs. When you use panic, you are using a noun that can also be a verb.
She panicked.
You can't say, "She insaned". You need a verb between the noun and the adjective. "She went insane."
Any word that I know describing insanity is an adjective, even such forms as demented. So when you use panic as "panicked into the underbrush." you are using it as a verb. In the poem, you are trying to pretend that an adjective is a verb, thus denoting the "action" between the noun/subject and the adjective. You simply cannot connect a noun to and adjective using the same adjective. Sentences at their simplest must have at a minimum both a noun and a verb. e.g. "He wept." To try and use an adjective in the place of a verb you get nonsense. "He insane." Either that or you end up talking like Mike Tyson. The nearest I can think of describing what you a trying to say would be something like.
"She went insanely into the room."
It is still a bizarre sentence and it is still incorrect as it uses an adjective as an adverb, but people might not have quite so much a problem with it.
Tectak is absolutely right however, when it comes down to reality. If you do not follow the agreed upon rules of communication, then what you have written can basically mean anything. This is not the point of poetry (and yes I can, I've paid my dues many times over), the purpose is to clearly as possible communicate difficult concepts or experiences. This does not happen by starting off with faulty communication. Actually I am heartened to see no one rushing to defend your nonsensical usage, hopefully that will prevent you from wasting years in the folly that comes from writing nonsensical abstract poetry that is so prevalent on the web today.
yesterday
orange peeled
cast off apple core
squeezing citrus appeal
bruised on
cruel highlands cold
you are no more
Try this. You are describing a scene, like in a movie. Describe it in grammatical sentences the best you can. After that work on using metaphorical language to get the description closer to what you are feeling. Do not try to describe it directly, say what it is like. Metaphors are what poets use to describe something to the rest of us that there is no common language to discuss. Take care to make a distinction between a physical occurrence and a mental one.
And as Tectak said, and do yourself a favor, just accept as true that if a reader fails to understand what the writer is trying to communicate then the failure rest with the writer, not the reader.
Here is an example, at one time I had a very difficult time grasping Einstein's theory of Relativity (evidently that is still the case today, since they are still looking for the Higgs boson), but that was not due to him not expressing himself clearly, it was due to the fact that the ideas were counter-intuitive to my everyday experience. I could understand perfectly what he was saying, I just couldn't as yet grasp it. Often we have to struggle with the ideas in poetry, but it should never be because it is written in an unclear way.
"The bunny is stoic so it stays still" Actually, stoic bunnies stay unmoving.
Dale
PS This isn't a rant against Mark, or anyone in particular, it is the frustration I feel that such BS is not only condoned, but encouraged and applauded. It truly is the Emperor's new clothes, but should anyone point that out, they are told they are just to stupid to get it.
Here are the best I can think of but it won't work.
She crazed into the room" "she demented into the room"
The problem is that when you say someone is insane you are using an adjective because you are describing a state of being. Such words cannot be used as verbs. When you use panic, you are using a noun that can also be a verb.
She panicked.
You can't say, "She insaned". You need a verb between the noun and the adjective. "She went insane."
Any word that I know describing insanity is an adjective, even such forms as demented. So when you use panic as "panicked into the underbrush." you are using it as a verb. In the poem, you are trying to pretend that an adjective is a verb, thus denoting the "action" between the noun/subject and the adjective. You simply cannot connect a noun to and adjective using the same adjective. Sentences at their simplest must have at a minimum both a noun and a verb. e.g. "He wept." To try and use an adjective in the place of a verb you get nonsense. "He insane." Either that or you end up talking like Mike Tyson. The nearest I can think of describing what you a trying to say would be something like.
"She went insanely into the room."
It is still a bizarre sentence and it is still incorrect as it uses an adjective as an adverb, but people might not have quite so much a problem with it.
Tectak is absolutely right however, when it comes down to reality. If you do not follow the agreed upon rules of communication, then what you have written can basically mean anything. This is not the point of poetry (and yes I can, I've paid my dues many times over), the purpose is to clearly as possible communicate difficult concepts or experiences. This does not happen by starting off with faulty communication. Actually I am heartened to see no one rushing to defend your nonsensical usage, hopefully that will prevent you from wasting years in the folly that comes from writing nonsensical abstract poetry that is so prevalent on the web today.
yesterday
orange peeled
cast off apple core
squeezing citrus appeal
bruised on
cruel highlands cold
you are no more
Try this. You are describing a scene, like in a movie. Describe it in grammatical sentences the best you can. After that work on using metaphorical language to get the description closer to what you are feeling. Do not try to describe it directly, say what it is like. Metaphors are what poets use to describe something to the rest of us that there is no common language to discuss. Take care to make a distinction between a physical occurrence and a mental one.
And as Tectak said, and do yourself a favor, just accept as true that if a reader fails to understand what the writer is trying to communicate then the failure rest with the writer, not the reader.
Here is an example, at one time I had a very difficult time grasping Einstein's theory of Relativity (evidently that is still the case today, since they are still looking for the Higgs boson), but that was not due to him not expressing himself clearly, it was due to the fact that the ideas were counter-intuitive to my everyday experience. I could understand perfectly what he was saying, I just couldn't as yet grasp it. Often we have to struggle with the ideas in poetry, but it should never be because it is written in an unclear way.
"The bunny is stoic so it stays still" Actually, stoic bunnies stay unmoving.
Dale
PS This isn't a rant against Mark, or anyone in particular, it is the frustration I feel that such BS is not only condoned, but encouraged and applauded. It truly is the Emperor's new clothes, but should anyone point that out, they are told they are just to stupid to get it.
How long after picking up the brush, the first masterpiece?
The goal is not to obfuscate that which is clear, but make clear that which isn't.
The goal is not to obfuscate that which is clear, but make clear that which isn't.
-- these first lines look like they're the ones causing the most problems, so I'd suggest a rewrite in a slightly different direction, perhaps something like:
